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[00:00:07] Scott Benton: Hey everyone, Scott Benton here. How are you? I’m the host of the Classroom 2 Courtroom podcast where we help you easily transition from law school student into your professional life as an attorney and it’s where we make the practice of law fun. Today we’re going to answer the question of how Do you dig deeply for case facts?
[00:00:27] Scott Benton: How? Not why? How do you dig deeply for case facts? But we will discuss the why as well.
[00:00:34] Scott Benton: [00:01:00] Now when it comes to the rigors of accumulating your case facts You want to know that ultimately? These case facts they’re going to help inform the type of evidence that you’re going to want to introduce into your case But that’s not really all you’re also Going to want case facts because At the end of the day, they’re going to help you paint a bigger, brighter picture and really tell the story and sell the story, more importantly, of your case and sell it in such a manner that anybody listening to your story would find themselves [00:02:00] completely riveted.
[00:02:01] Scott Benton: Exactly the way that they’re riveted sitting in front of a Netflix series that they end up binge watching. in only one sitting. So digging up case facts and digging as deeply as possible, that’s gonna be a way for you to exhaust your client. It’s gonna put them in a state where they literally just brain dump all of their case facts, all of that information, and they pour it out of their head.
[00:02:28] Scott Benton: And so for a moment, there’s this moment in time in theory where their brain is now totally empty. Because it’s it’s unburdened from storing all of those case facts and sometimes people carry that stuff around for absolutely years. In a short amount of time, new case facts and new memories, they’re gonna, they’re gonna come flooding in and they’re gonna fill up all of that empty space in your client’s brain.
[00:02:53] Scott Benton: And. They’re going to start to create new key insights and new memories [00:03:00] and their ideas and their sort of recollections that your client would probably never have been able to get to because getting to those sort of more, I don’t want to call them hidden facts, but facts that are just so cluttered over by just the overburden, some amount of facts in the first place, just really hard to get to them.
[00:03:23] Scott Benton: And you really can’t get to them any other way until that person just. Empties their mind completely. So you now have all of these key insights that just materialize and arrive. And it’s these key insights that sometimes they contain a few real sort of Game changing case facts that honestly, they can reshape the story that you’ve already crafted of your case, and it’ll reshape it in a way that updates your story.
[00:03:54] Scott Benton: It fills in the gaps that strengthens your ability to really punch [00:04:00] some of those beats in your story, and it’s gonna bolden your core argument. This in turn, it’s going to allow you and your client to finally, really with a lot of clarity, see what the case is all about. It’s going to provide a better roadmap for both of you in just navigating your case’s strategy, simply because you just have more information to work with.
[00:04:24] Scott Benton: From what you find out after digging into the deeper layers of memory of your client’s recollections, and with all of their new information. Sometimes they’re fragments. They’re incomplete thoughts. They’re just, people get to a point where they’re trying to figure out what all of this like this tidal wave of information is that’s coming into their mind with this conversation that you’re having with them.
[00:04:48] Scott Benton: But those ideas are beginning. They’re gonna start to emerge, throughout this process. They may not make sense right away, but as time goes on, Those idea fragments are going to start [00:05:00] to form a more cohesive picture. And you’re finally going to have, eventually, through this process, Everything that you need to prepare your case and really arm yourself with the best possible chance of prevailing, which you want to be in the strongest position that you can be in.
[00:05:18] Scott Benton: So with that in mind, we want to make sure that we know how to dig up those case facts because this isn’t necessarily an easy process. This takes practice. It takes time, but you want to be able to have this vocabulary. You want to be able to know that you’re going to go. three layers down, let’s say.
[00:05:37] Scott Benton: That’s what we say at the law firm that I work at. We’re focused on going three layers down and that’s just not an easy process to do, especially right off the bat. If you’re starting your career and this is your first job as an attorney, getting down really into the sort of connective tissue of that case story is going to be [00:06:00] a little unfamiliar, let’s say.
[00:06:02] Scott Benton: But if you know that’s your target, then it helps you define the direction that you’re going to go with this and the way that you’re going to get into it and the more you do it the better you get it’s just one of those things but if you know the strategy it helps you get better faster and that’s what we want for you this is going to be fun this is going to be engaging now that you know that we’re going to set our goal for getting three layers deep so just know it’s not exactly easy to get your client to do that and get them to a place where they just push everything out of their mind.
[00:06:36] Scott Benton: But first of all, you want to make sure that you’ve used the very best of your relationship building skills and that you’ve been able to get to a point where you can create instant rapport with people that when you first meet them, there’s an immediate connection. That’s instant rapport, and that’s something you can do if you focus on.
[00:06:58] Scott Benton: And if you practice, [00:07:00] a new client that comes along, you’re going to have them, boom, immediately, you’re going to figure out how to connect with them. And you want to make sure, to help you do that, one of the best places to start, I’m not saying it’s going to be the answer in every case to achieve instant rapport.
[00:07:14] Scott Benton: That more or less comes over time, but there are plenty of shortcuts to get there. And probably one of the biggest shortcuts is to read this book. That you’ve probably heard about a thousand times. Maybe you’ve read it already. If you haven’t, you should really go pick it up. The book is called How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie.
[00:07:34] Scott Benton: It’s written, I think, in 19, what, like 27 or 34 or something a long time ago, almost a hundred years ago. And this Dale Carnegie book is gonna really help you explore those skills that you either have or you’re lacking. You’re gonna strengthen the ones that you have. You’re gonna start to incorporate the ones that you don’t have, but it’s gonna help you strengthen your overall ability to just build trust with [00:08:00] anybody that you talk to.
[00:08:01] Scott Benton: And when it comes to your clients, it’s gonna help them get to a place very quickly. where they’re willing to just tell you anything about their case. Because, sometimes people they’re shy or maybe they’re embarrassed about some of the things that they did in the past or things that they said, and they just, they don’t know you that well.
[00:08:21] Scott Benton: They don’t want to mention them, especially in initial consultation, maybe down the road, if you’ve been able to really cement that bond with them. If you have that instant rapport, if you’ve been able to do that with them, then they’re gonna be more forthcoming with that information. But more of those embarrassing kind of facts, they tend to leave them out.
[00:08:42] Scott Benton: But if you’re able to get them into that place where they feel comfortable with you, they’re going to be more likely to present as much information as they possibly can because it’s their case. They know it’s their case and it’s to their benefit and behooves them. to tell you everything. But [00:09:00] again, people get embarrassed, people get, I get embarrassed, I get shy.
[00:09:03] Scott Benton: I don’t want to tell people absolutely everything. There’s things I could have done better in my life. In the heat of that moment, when you’re not thinking clearly, or maybe you’re really tired, or you’re just exhausted from, I don’t know, arguing with somebody, whatever the situation is, you’re not necessarily always at your best in terms of your ability to process information, think clearly and deliver.
[00:09:25] Scott Benton: an appropriate response that you’re satisfied with. How many times are we driving in our car and we’re playing that back in our head that moment and we come up with, 20 different variations on things that we could have said and should have said, but we didn’t say it. And now we feel bad.
[00:09:42] Scott Benton: Now we get to carry around that embarrassment or that, I don’t know, shame or that feeling that negative feeling. And a lot of clients, Because clients are just people and pretty much everybody has these moments in their lives. Clients aren’t going to really open up to you. But if you do bond [00:10:00] with them, then they’re more likely to just simply open up the floodgates.
[00:10:04] Scott Benton: And that’s why you want to read Dale Carnegie’s How to Win Friends and Influence People. And practice. Now at this point, you want to start to use a series of open ended questions. That’s going to help create depth. Thanks. In the recollections that your client has, and it’s going to allow you to really plumb into the depths of their memory and squeeze out every detail and every nuance that they have inside their mind.
[00:10:28] Scott Benton: Now, some of those open ended questions might be something like, tell me more about that, or what did they say to that, or, and then what happened, and then what happened. And then what happened? By the way, and then what happened? It’s such a good open ended question. If you forget everything else, just remember, and then what happened, because you can ask it over and over and over again, and no one.
[00:10:56] Scott Benton: I’m telling you, they’re not even going to notice that you’re just asking the [00:11:00] same question repeatedly over and over again. And I myself, I lean on this all the time. And I would suggest you try it out on your friends or your family. When they start telling you a story about something, it could be really incidental.
[00:11:14] Scott Benton: It could be about, going down to the mall or going to a movie or doing something with their friends or whatever it is. Just start saying. As a test, start saying, and then what happened? And then what happened? And it’s going to become the most interesting story you’ve ever heard. Yeah. You try it. You’ll see what I mean. So as far as open ended question goes, As far as they go, open ended questions. This particular one, for some reason, and then what happened? This particular open ended question, it just, for some reason, it just tends to work magic.
[00:11:50] Scott Benton: Although, as you’re going to see, there’s going to be many open ended questions that you can choose from. And you should probably get familiar with a lot of them. Some are going to be just [00:12:00] better than others. Off the bat, you should probably memorize a number of just default open ended questions that you can go to, like four or five or six of them.
[00:12:08] Scott Benton: Just, and then what happens? A great one. But there may be others that you just want to have. on the ready in case you need to reach for them. And as your client is talking and when they’re remembering details, eventually they’re going to run out of steam. They’re just going to simply run out of things to say.
[00:12:24] Scott Benton: And you’ll know that when that happens, when they stop, they just, I don’t, I can’t remember anything else. You simply can move on to another topic. So to summarize it, you want to be able to create instant rapport with your client. You want to get them to open up to you as much as possible and just spill their guts about their case. You want to be able to ask them open ended questions and you want to completely exhaust them one topic at a time and when they’re
[00:12:52] Scott Benton: at a place where, they just can’t say anything more about a particular topic, that’s when you move on to the next topic. And [00:13:00] hopefully, that’s going to generate just an absolute treasure trove of important new case facts for you. So I hope this is helpful. I’m Scott Benton. I’m the host of the Classroom 2 Courtroom podcast.
[00:13:11] Scott Benton: Thank you so much for tuning into this episode where we took a look at how to dig deeply for your case facts. Now, if you like this material, if this is helpful, if you enjoy the approach we’re taking of helping you transition from law school student into your professional career and teaching you what it means to practice law, a subject that you are not going to learn in law school, Or in any bar prep course, that’s for sure.
[00:13:35] Scott Benton: And you want to get an alert every time we put out a new episode, you can go to our website. Our website is classroom2courtroom. com. That’s classroom, the number two, courtroom. com. You can leave us your contact information. That way you’ll get an alert every time we put out a new episode. And and you can you can join us there.
[00:13:53] Scott Benton: Now, if this is material that you are enjoying, don’t forget, of course, to share and subscribe. And that will help you stay on top of [00:14:00] our newest episodes as well. Until next time, we hope you’ll join us in making the world a better place, one client at a time.
[00:14:08] Scott Benton: Thank you so much.
